Recursive proof that $n^n geq n!$ [duplicate]
$begingroup$
This question already has an answer here:
Induction Proof $n! < n^n$ [closed]
2 answers
So I'm trying to prove, by induction, that
$$ n^n geq n!, forall ngeq1$$
Base case:
$$ text{For } n=1, 1^1 = 1 geq 1 = 1!$$
Hypothesis:
$$ n^n geq n!$$
Step:
$$ text{Trying to prove: } n^{n+1} geq (n+1)! $$
Now, somewhere around here I get some contradicting things. For example, if I start from the right side I get:
$$ (n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n = ncdot n^n + n^n = n^{n+1} + n^n$$
Based on this I would need $n^{n+1} + n^n$ to be less than or equal to $n^{n+1}$, which is certainly not true. Something similar happens when I go the other way.
Any ideas what I'm doing wrong here?
Thanks.
induction
$endgroup$
marked as duplicate by amWhy, John Bentin, Leucippus, Adrian Keister, Cesareo Jan 1 at 0:49
This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.
|
show 2 more comments
$begingroup$
This question already has an answer here:
Induction Proof $n! < n^n$ [closed]
2 answers
So I'm trying to prove, by induction, that
$$ n^n geq n!, forall ngeq1$$
Base case:
$$ text{For } n=1, 1^1 = 1 geq 1 = 1!$$
Hypothesis:
$$ n^n geq n!$$
Step:
$$ text{Trying to prove: } n^{n+1} geq (n+1)! $$
Now, somewhere around here I get some contradicting things. For example, if I start from the right side I get:
$$ (n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n = ncdot n^n + n^n = n^{n+1} + n^n$$
Based on this I would need $n^{n+1} + n^n$ to be less than or equal to $n^{n+1}$, which is certainly not true. Something similar happens when I go the other way.
Any ideas what I'm doing wrong here?
Thanks.
induction
$endgroup$
marked as duplicate by amWhy, John Bentin, Leucippus, Adrian Keister, Cesareo Jan 1 at 0:49
This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.
4
$begingroup$
"Trying to prove: $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$" No: Trying to prove: $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:29
1
$begingroup$
Well, now I feel stupid. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– Koy
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
3
$begingroup$
Do you have to prove this with induction? I think you could just write out what the two terms mean, and you will see that the hypothesis is true.
$endgroup$
– Matti P.
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
$begingroup$
Indeed induction is not at all the most direct route here.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
6
$begingroup$
"Well, now I feel stupid." Who never does? "Thanks." You are welcome.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
|
show 2 more comments
$begingroup$
This question already has an answer here:
Induction Proof $n! < n^n$ [closed]
2 answers
So I'm trying to prove, by induction, that
$$ n^n geq n!, forall ngeq1$$
Base case:
$$ text{For } n=1, 1^1 = 1 geq 1 = 1!$$
Hypothesis:
$$ n^n geq n!$$
Step:
$$ text{Trying to prove: } n^{n+1} geq (n+1)! $$
Now, somewhere around here I get some contradicting things. For example, if I start from the right side I get:
$$ (n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n = ncdot n^n + n^n = n^{n+1} + n^n$$
Based on this I would need $n^{n+1} + n^n$ to be less than or equal to $n^{n+1}$, which is certainly not true. Something similar happens when I go the other way.
Any ideas what I'm doing wrong here?
Thanks.
induction
$endgroup$
This question already has an answer here:
Induction Proof $n! < n^n$ [closed]
2 answers
So I'm trying to prove, by induction, that
$$ n^n geq n!, forall ngeq1$$
Base case:
$$ text{For } n=1, 1^1 = 1 geq 1 = 1!$$
Hypothesis:
$$ n^n geq n!$$
Step:
$$ text{Trying to prove: } n^{n+1} geq (n+1)! $$
Now, somewhere around here I get some contradicting things. For example, if I start from the right side I get:
$$ (n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n = ncdot n^n + n^n = n^{n+1} + n^n$$
Based on this I would need $n^{n+1} + n^n$ to be less than or equal to $n^{n+1}$, which is certainly not true. Something similar happens when I go the other way.
Any ideas what I'm doing wrong here?
Thanks.
This question already has an answer here:
Induction Proof $n! < n^n$ [closed]
2 answers
induction
induction
edited Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
Did
248k23223460
248k23223460
asked Dec 14 '18 at 12:27
KoyKoy
35116
35116
marked as duplicate by amWhy, John Bentin, Leucippus, Adrian Keister, Cesareo Jan 1 at 0:49
This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.
marked as duplicate by amWhy, John Bentin, Leucippus, Adrian Keister, Cesareo Jan 1 at 0:49
This question has been asked before and already has an answer. If those answers do not fully address your question, please ask a new question.
4
$begingroup$
"Trying to prove: $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$" No: Trying to prove: $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:29
1
$begingroup$
Well, now I feel stupid. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– Koy
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
3
$begingroup$
Do you have to prove this with induction? I think you could just write out what the two terms mean, and you will see that the hypothesis is true.
$endgroup$
– Matti P.
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
$begingroup$
Indeed induction is not at all the most direct route here.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
6
$begingroup$
"Well, now I feel stupid." Who never does? "Thanks." You are welcome.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
|
show 2 more comments
4
$begingroup$
"Trying to prove: $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$" No: Trying to prove: $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:29
1
$begingroup$
Well, now I feel stupid. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– Koy
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
3
$begingroup$
Do you have to prove this with induction? I think you could just write out what the two terms mean, and you will see that the hypothesis is true.
$endgroup$
– Matti P.
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
$begingroup$
Indeed induction is not at all the most direct route here.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
6
$begingroup$
"Well, now I feel stupid." Who never does? "Thanks." You are welcome.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
4
4
$begingroup$
"Trying to prove: $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$" No: Trying to prove: $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:29
$begingroup$
"Trying to prove: $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$" No: Trying to prove: $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:29
1
1
$begingroup$
Well, now I feel stupid. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– Koy
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
$begingroup$
Well, now I feel stupid. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– Koy
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
3
3
$begingroup$
Do you have to prove this with induction? I think you could just write out what the two terms mean, and you will see that the hypothesis is true.
$endgroup$
– Matti P.
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
$begingroup$
Do you have to prove this with induction? I think you could just write out what the two terms mean, and you will see that the hypothesis is true.
$endgroup$
– Matti P.
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
$begingroup$
Indeed induction is not at all the most direct route here.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
$begingroup$
Indeed induction is not at all the most direct route here.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
6
6
$begingroup$
"Well, now I feel stupid." Who never does? "Thanks." You are welcome.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
$begingroup$
"Well, now I feel stupid." Who never does? "Thanks." You are welcome.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
|
show 2 more comments
5 Answers
5
active
oldest
votes
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$(n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n$ by induction hypothesis, and
$(n+1)cdot n^nleq (n+1)cdot (n+1)^n = (n+1)^{n+1}$. Done.
$endgroup$
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I don't know why, but your answer shows"$leq (n+1) by cdot n^n$" even though you did not type it that way.
$endgroup$
– AryanSonwatikar
Dec 14 '18 at 15:40
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You should try to prove that $$(n+1)^{n+1} ge (n+1)!$$
begin{align}
(n+1)^{n+1} &= (n+1) (n+1)^n\
&ge(n+1)n^n
end{align}
Now use induction hypothesis.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are trying to prove :
$$(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
Not :
$$n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
This isn't an answer! Can you show some steps ?
$endgroup$
– Archis Welankar
Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
4
$begingroup$
@ArchisWelankar I am answering his question. There is nothing to add. And you downvote, what a ridiculous behaviour.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Dec 14 '18 at 12:33
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You need to show that $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$, not that $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$.
Here are some similar questions asked before: you can check your work against any of them if you'd like.
- Induction Proof $n! < n^n$
- Show that $n!<n^n $ where $n>1$ and is a Positive Integer
- Proof of $forall n in Bbb N$, $n > 2 implies n! < n^n$
For future reference, Approach0 is an excellent resource to search for similar questions (much better than the SE functionality itself). All the best.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
As an alternative:
$$
n! = underbrace{{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}}_{n text{times}} \
n^n = underbrace{n cdot ncdot n dots n}_{n text{times}}
$$
Note that:
$$
{n! over n^n} = frac{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}{n cdot ncdot n dots n} = \
= frac{n}{n} cdot frac{n-1}{n} cdot frac{n-2}{n} cdots frac{2}{n} cdot frac{1}{n}
$$
Now note that for any $n ge 2$:
$$
frac{n!}{n^n} < 1
$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
5 Answers
5
active
oldest
votes
5 Answers
5
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
$(n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n$ by induction hypothesis, and
$(n+1)cdot n^nleq (n+1)cdot (n+1)^n = (n+1)^{n+1}$. Done.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
I don't know why, but your answer shows"$leq (n+1) by cdot n^n$" even though you did not type it that way.
$endgroup$
– AryanSonwatikar
Dec 14 '18 at 15:40
add a comment |
$begingroup$
$(n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n$ by induction hypothesis, and
$(n+1)cdot n^nleq (n+1)cdot (n+1)^n = (n+1)^{n+1}$. Done.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
I don't know why, but your answer shows"$leq (n+1) by cdot n^n$" even though you did not type it that way.
$endgroup$
– AryanSonwatikar
Dec 14 '18 at 15:40
add a comment |
$begingroup$
$(n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n$ by induction hypothesis, and
$(n+1)cdot n^nleq (n+1)cdot (n+1)^n = (n+1)^{n+1}$. Done.
$endgroup$
$(n+1)! = (n+1)cdot n! leq (n+1)cdot n^n$ by induction hypothesis, and
$(n+1)cdot n^nleq (n+1)cdot (n+1)^n = (n+1)^{n+1}$. Done.
answered Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
WuestenfuxWuestenfux
4,4901413
4,4901413
$begingroup$
I don't know why, but your answer shows"$leq (n+1) by cdot n^n$" even though you did not type it that way.
$endgroup$
– AryanSonwatikar
Dec 14 '18 at 15:40
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I don't know why, but your answer shows"$leq (n+1) by cdot n^n$" even though you did not type it that way.
$endgroup$
– AryanSonwatikar
Dec 14 '18 at 15:40
$begingroup$
I don't know why, but your answer shows"$leq (n+1) by cdot n^n$" even though you did not type it that way.
$endgroup$
– AryanSonwatikar
Dec 14 '18 at 15:40
$begingroup$
I don't know why, but your answer shows"$leq (n+1) by cdot n^n$" even though you did not type it that way.
$endgroup$
– AryanSonwatikar
Dec 14 '18 at 15:40
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You should try to prove that $$(n+1)^{n+1} ge (n+1)!$$
begin{align}
(n+1)^{n+1} &= (n+1) (n+1)^n\
&ge(n+1)n^n
end{align}
Now use induction hypothesis.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You should try to prove that $$(n+1)^{n+1} ge (n+1)!$$
begin{align}
(n+1)^{n+1} &= (n+1) (n+1)^n\
&ge(n+1)n^n
end{align}
Now use induction hypothesis.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You should try to prove that $$(n+1)^{n+1} ge (n+1)!$$
begin{align}
(n+1)^{n+1} &= (n+1) (n+1)^n\
&ge(n+1)n^n
end{align}
Now use induction hypothesis.
$endgroup$
You should try to prove that $$(n+1)^{n+1} ge (n+1)!$$
begin{align}
(n+1)^{n+1} &= (n+1) (n+1)^n\
&ge(n+1)n^n
end{align}
Now use induction hypothesis.
answered Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
Siong Thye GohSiong Thye Goh
101k1466118
101k1466118
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are trying to prove :
$$(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
Not :
$$n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
This isn't an answer! Can you show some steps ?
$endgroup$
– Archis Welankar
Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
4
$begingroup$
@ArchisWelankar I am answering his question. There is nothing to add. And you downvote, what a ridiculous behaviour.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Dec 14 '18 at 12:33
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are trying to prove :
$$(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
Not :
$$n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
This isn't an answer! Can you show some steps ?
$endgroup$
– Archis Welankar
Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
4
$begingroup$
@ArchisWelankar I am answering his question. There is nothing to add. And you downvote, what a ridiculous behaviour.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Dec 14 '18 at 12:33
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You are trying to prove :
$$(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
Not :
$$n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
$endgroup$
You are trying to prove :
$$(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
Not :
$$n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$$
answered Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
ThinkingThinking
1,11416
1,11416
$begingroup$
This isn't an answer! Can you show some steps ?
$endgroup$
– Archis Welankar
Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
4
$begingroup$
@ArchisWelankar I am answering his question. There is nothing to add. And you downvote, what a ridiculous behaviour.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Dec 14 '18 at 12:33
add a comment |
$begingroup$
This isn't an answer! Can you show some steps ?
$endgroup$
– Archis Welankar
Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
4
$begingroup$
@ArchisWelankar I am answering his question. There is nothing to add. And you downvote, what a ridiculous behaviour.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Dec 14 '18 at 12:33
$begingroup$
This isn't an answer! Can you show some steps ?
$endgroup$
– Archis Welankar
Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
$begingroup$
This isn't an answer! Can you show some steps ?
$endgroup$
– Archis Welankar
Dec 14 '18 at 12:32
4
4
$begingroup$
@ArchisWelankar I am answering his question. There is nothing to add. And you downvote, what a ridiculous behaviour.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Dec 14 '18 at 12:33
$begingroup$
@ArchisWelankar I am answering his question. There is nothing to add. And you downvote, what a ridiculous behaviour.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Dec 14 '18 at 12:33
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You need to show that $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$, not that $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$.
Here are some similar questions asked before: you can check your work against any of them if you'd like.
- Induction Proof $n! < n^n$
- Show that $n!<n^n $ where $n>1$ and is a Positive Integer
- Proof of $forall n in Bbb N$, $n > 2 implies n! < n^n$
For future reference, Approach0 is an excellent resource to search for similar questions (much better than the SE functionality itself). All the best.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You need to show that $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$, not that $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$.
Here are some similar questions asked before: you can check your work against any of them if you'd like.
- Induction Proof $n! < n^n$
- Show that $n!<n^n $ where $n>1$ and is a Positive Integer
- Proof of $forall n in Bbb N$, $n > 2 implies n! < n^n$
For future reference, Approach0 is an excellent resource to search for similar questions (much better than the SE functionality itself). All the best.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You need to show that $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$, not that $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$.
Here are some similar questions asked before: you can check your work against any of them if you'd like.
- Induction Proof $n! < n^n$
- Show that $n!<n^n $ where $n>1$ and is a Positive Integer
- Proof of $forall n in Bbb N$, $n > 2 implies n! < n^n$
For future reference, Approach0 is an excellent resource to search for similar questions (much better than the SE functionality itself). All the best.
$endgroup$
You need to show that $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$, not that $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$.
Here are some similar questions asked before: you can check your work against any of them if you'd like.
- Induction Proof $n! < n^n$
- Show that $n!<n^n $ where $n>1$ and is a Positive Integer
- Proof of $forall n in Bbb N$, $n > 2 implies n! < n^n$
For future reference, Approach0 is an excellent resource to search for similar questions (much better than the SE functionality itself). All the best.
answered Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
BrahadeeshBrahadeesh
6,35442363
6,35442363
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
As an alternative:
$$
n! = underbrace{{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}}_{n text{times}} \
n^n = underbrace{n cdot ncdot n dots n}_{n text{times}}
$$
Note that:
$$
{n! over n^n} = frac{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}{n cdot ncdot n dots n} = \
= frac{n}{n} cdot frac{n-1}{n} cdot frac{n-2}{n} cdots frac{2}{n} cdot frac{1}{n}
$$
Now note that for any $n ge 2$:
$$
frac{n!}{n^n} < 1
$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
As an alternative:
$$
n! = underbrace{{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}}_{n text{times}} \
n^n = underbrace{n cdot ncdot n dots n}_{n text{times}}
$$
Note that:
$$
{n! over n^n} = frac{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}{n cdot ncdot n dots n} = \
= frac{n}{n} cdot frac{n-1}{n} cdot frac{n-2}{n} cdots frac{2}{n} cdot frac{1}{n}
$$
Now note that for any $n ge 2$:
$$
frac{n!}{n^n} < 1
$$
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
As an alternative:
$$
n! = underbrace{{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}}_{n text{times}} \
n^n = underbrace{n cdot ncdot n dots n}_{n text{times}}
$$
Note that:
$$
{n! over n^n} = frac{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}{n cdot ncdot n dots n} = \
= frac{n}{n} cdot frac{n-1}{n} cdot frac{n-2}{n} cdots frac{2}{n} cdot frac{1}{n}
$$
Now note that for any $n ge 2$:
$$
frac{n!}{n^n} < 1
$$
$endgroup$
As an alternative:
$$
n! = underbrace{{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}}_{n text{times}} \
n^n = underbrace{n cdot ncdot n dots n}_{n text{times}}
$$
Note that:
$$
{n! over n^n} = frac{n(n-1)(n-2)cdots 3cdot 2cdot 1}{n cdot ncdot n dots n} = \
= frac{n}{n} cdot frac{n-1}{n} cdot frac{n-2}{n} cdots frac{2}{n} cdot frac{1}{n}
$$
Now note that for any $n ge 2$:
$$
frac{n!}{n^n} < 1
$$
answered Dec 14 '18 at 12:38
romanroman
2,21921224
2,21921224
add a comment |
add a comment |
4
$begingroup$
"Trying to prove: $n^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$" No: Trying to prove: $(n+1)^{n+1} geq (n+1)!$
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:29
1
$begingroup$
Well, now I feel stupid. Thanks.
$endgroup$
– Koy
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
3
$begingroup$
Do you have to prove this with induction? I think you could just write out what the two terms mean, and you will see that the hypothesis is true.
$endgroup$
– Matti P.
Dec 14 '18 at 12:30
$begingroup$
Indeed induction is not at all the most direct route here.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31
6
$begingroup$
"Well, now I feel stupid." Who never does? "Thanks." You are welcome.
$endgroup$
– Did
Dec 14 '18 at 12:31