Why is “Some men have brown hair” $exists x(M(x) wedge B(x))$ but “All men have brown hair” isn't...
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As the title says, I'm not sure why "Some men have with brown hair" is $exists x(M(x) wedge B(x))$, but "All men have brown hair" isn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$?
Doesn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$ read as "For every $x$, $x$ is a man and $x$ has brown hair?" In other words all men have brown hair.
I'm aware that the correct statement is $forall x(M(x) Rightarrow B(x))$, which reads as "For every $x$, if $x$ is a man, then $x$ has brown hair."
$M(x)$ means "$x$ is a man", and $B(x)$ means "$x$ has brown hair."
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As the title says, I'm not sure why "Some men have with brown hair" is $exists x(M(x) wedge B(x))$, but "All men have brown hair" isn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$?
Doesn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$ read as "For every $x$, $x$ is a man and $x$ has brown hair?" In other words all men have brown hair.
I'm aware that the correct statement is $forall x(M(x) Rightarrow B(x))$, which reads as "For every $x$, if $x$ is a man, then $x$ has brown hair."
$M(x)$ means "$x$ is a man", and $B(x)$ means "$x$ has brown hair."
logic
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That depends on what your domain is. If your domain is the set of all people then the statement $forall xleft( M(x)wedge B(x)right)$ translates as "Every person is a male with brown hair." You have seemingly ignored the possibilities of females being present too.
– JMoravitz
Nov 26 at 6:14
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As the title says, I'm not sure why "Some men have with brown hair" is $exists x(M(x) wedge B(x))$, but "All men have brown hair" isn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$?
Doesn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$ read as "For every $x$, $x$ is a man and $x$ has brown hair?" In other words all men have brown hair.
I'm aware that the correct statement is $forall x(M(x) Rightarrow B(x))$, which reads as "For every $x$, if $x$ is a man, then $x$ has brown hair."
$M(x)$ means "$x$ is a man", and $B(x)$ means "$x$ has brown hair."
logic
As the title says, I'm not sure why "Some men have with brown hair" is $exists x(M(x) wedge B(x))$, but "All men have brown hair" isn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$?
Doesn't $forall x(M(x) wedge B(x))$ read as "For every $x$, $x$ is a man and $x$ has brown hair?" In other words all men have brown hair.
I'm aware that the correct statement is $forall x(M(x) Rightarrow B(x))$, which reads as "For every $x$, if $x$ is a man, then $x$ has brown hair."
$M(x)$ means "$x$ is a man", and $B(x)$ means "$x$ has brown hair."
logic
logic
edited Nov 26 at 6:23
Eevee Trainer
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2,614221
asked Nov 26 at 6:07
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154
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That depends on what your domain is. If your domain is the set of all people then the statement $forall xleft( M(x)wedge B(x)right)$ translates as "Every person is a male with brown hair." You have seemingly ignored the possibilities of females being present too.
– JMoravitz
Nov 26 at 6:14
add a comment |
2
That depends on what your domain is. If your domain is the set of all people then the statement $forall xleft( M(x)wedge B(x)right)$ translates as "Every person is a male with brown hair." You have seemingly ignored the possibilities of females being present too.
– JMoravitz
Nov 26 at 6:14
2
2
That depends on what your domain is. If your domain is the set of all people then the statement $forall xleft( M(x)wedge B(x)right)$ translates as "Every person is a male with brown hair." You have seemingly ignored the possibilities of females being present too.
– JMoravitz
Nov 26 at 6:14
That depends on what your domain is. If your domain is the set of all people then the statement $forall xleft( M(x)wedge B(x)right)$ translates as "Every person is a male with brown hair." You have seemingly ignored the possibilities of females being present too.
– JMoravitz
Nov 26 at 6:14
add a comment |
2 Answers
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It seems like you want to read $forall x (M(x)wedge B(x))$ as saying
For all men $x$, it is true that $x$ has brown hair.
Which is different from the following statement:
For all $x$, it is true that $x$ is a man and has brown hair.
The difference is that, in the first statement, $x$ is necessarily a man. In the second statement, we could take $x$ to be a rock*, and we would claim that it is a man with brown hair. The symbol "$forall x$" means that, no matter what we take $x$ to be, the following statement is true of it.
A common thing to write, however, to express the first statement is
$$forall xin M(B(x))$$
where $M$ is the set of all men; this means that we restrict the choice of $x$ to be within this set - although this is the same as
$$forall x(M(x)rightarrow B(x)).$$
(*Of course, when working in logic, there's generally a well-defined sense of what $x$ could be - but here, unless $M(x)$ is true of every $x$, the statements are not interchangeable - and, speaking informally, it's unlikely that $x$ is implicitly understood to be a man)
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It's ultimately a matter of what you're trying to imply.
To say there are some men with brown hair means that both conditions hold true; there exists a person who is both male ($M(x)$) and has brown hair ($B(x)$).
However, think about what it says to say "all men have brown hair." "All men have" is basically saying "$M(x) Rightarrow text{(something)}$". To say "all men have" something is making an ever-so-subtle assumption that being a man implies something.
Another problem with the use of the "and" operator here is the subtle assumption that the $x$'s you're dealing with are people. To say "$forall x, M(x) wedge B(x)$" makes the implication that all people ($x$) are both male ($M(x)$) and have brown hair ($B(x)$). However, we know there are also women among the $x$'s, so that doesn't work out does it?
It's not as overt as saying "$x$ implies $y$," and in the nuances of the English one would look at them as being logically equivalent; it took me a while to even notice myself the nuance. This is probably where your confusion comes from.
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
It seems like you want to read $forall x (M(x)wedge B(x))$ as saying
For all men $x$, it is true that $x$ has brown hair.
Which is different from the following statement:
For all $x$, it is true that $x$ is a man and has brown hair.
The difference is that, in the first statement, $x$ is necessarily a man. In the second statement, we could take $x$ to be a rock*, and we would claim that it is a man with brown hair. The symbol "$forall x$" means that, no matter what we take $x$ to be, the following statement is true of it.
A common thing to write, however, to express the first statement is
$$forall xin M(B(x))$$
where $M$ is the set of all men; this means that we restrict the choice of $x$ to be within this set - although this is the same as
$$forall x(M(x)rightarrow B(x)).$$
(*Of course, when working in logic, there's generally a well-defined sense of what $x$ could be - but here, unless $M(x)$ is true of every $x$, the statements are not interchangeable - and, speaking informally, it's unlikely that $x$ is implicitly understood to be a man)
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
It seems like you want to read $forall x (M(x)wedge B(x))$ as saying
For all men $x$, it is true that $x$ has brown hair.
Which is different from the following statement:
For all $x$, it is true that $x$ is a man and has brown hair.
The difference is that, in the first statement, $x$ is necessarily a man. In the second statement, we could take $x$ to be a rock*, and we would claim that it is a man with brown hair. The symbol "$forall x$" means that, no matter what we take $x$ to be, the following statement is true of it.
A common thing to write, however, to express the first statement is
$$forall xin M(B(x))$$
where $M$ is the set of all men; this means that we restrict the choice of $x$ to be within this set - although this is the same as
$$forall x(M(x)rightarrow B(x)).$$
(*Of course, when working in logic, there's generally a well-defined sense of what $x$ could be - but here, unless $M(x)$ is true of every $x$, the statements are not interchangeable - and, speaking informally, it's unlikely that $x$ is implicitly understood to be a man)
add a comment |
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
It seems like you want to read $forall x (M(x)wedge B(x))$ as saying
For all men $x$, it is true that $x$ has brown hair.
Which is different from the following statement:
For all $x$, it is true that $x$ is a man and has brown hair.
The difference is that, in the first statement, $x$ is necessarily a man. In the second statement, we could take $x$ to be a rock*, and we would claim that it is a man with brown hair. The symbol "$forall x$" means that, no matter what we take $x$ to be, the following statement is true of it.
A common thing to write, however, to express the first statement is
$$forall xin M(B(x))$$
where $M$ is the set of all men; this means that we restrict the choice of $x$ to be within this set - although this is the same as
$$forall x(M(x)rightarrow B(x)).$$
(*Of course, when working in logic, there's generally a well-defined sense of what $x$ could be - but here, unless $M(x)$ is true of every $x$, the statements are not interchangeable - and, speaking informally, it's unlikely that $x$ is implicitly understood to be a man)
It seems like you want to read $forall x (M(x)wedge B(x))$ as saying
For all men $x$, it is true that $x$ has brown hair.
Which is different from the following statement:
For all $x$, it is true that $x$ is a man and has brown hair.
The difference is that, in the first statement, $x$ is necessarily a man. In the second statement, we could take $x$ to be a rock*, and we would claim that it is a man with brown hair. The symbol "$forall x$" means that, no matter what we take $x$ to be, the following statement is true of it.
A common thing to write, however, to express the first statement is
$$forall xin M(B(x))$$
where $M$ is the set of all men; this means that we restrict the choice of $x$ to be within this set - although this is the same as
$$forall x(M(x)rightarrow B(x)).$$
(*Of course, when working in logic, there's generally a well-defined sense of what $x$ could be - but here, unless $M(x)$ is true of every $x$, the statements are not interchangeable - and, speaking informally, it's unlikely that $x$ is implicitly understood to be a man)
answered Nov 26 at 6:16
Milo Brandt
39k475137
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It's ultimately a matter of what you're trying to imply.
To say there are some men with brown hair means that both conditions hold true; there exists a person who is both male ($M(x)$) and has brown hair ($B(x)$).
However, think about what it says to say "all men have brown hair." "All men have" is basically saying "$M(x) Rightarrow text{(something)}$". To say "all men have" something is making an ever-so-subtle assumption that being a man implies something.
Another problem with the use of the "and" operator here is the subtle assumption that the $x$'s you're dealing with are people. To say "$forall x, M(x) wedge B(x)$" makes the implication that all people ($x$) are both male ($M(x)$) and have brown hair ($B(x)$). However, we know there are also women among the $x$'s, so that doesn't work out does it?
It's not as overt as saying "$x$ implies $y$," and in the nuances of the English one would look at them as being logically equivalent; it took me a while to even notice myself the nuance. This is probably where your confusion comes from.
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
It's ultimately a matter of what you're trying to imply.
To say there are some men with brown hair means that both conditions hold true; there exists a person who is both male ($M(x)$) and has brown hair ($B(x)$).
However, think about what it says to say "all men have brown hair." "All men have" is basically saying "$M(x) Rightarrow text{(something)}$". To say "all men have" something is making an ever-so-subtle assumption that being a man implies something.
Another problem with the use of the "and" operator here is the subtle assumption that the $x$'s you're dealing with are people. To say "$forall x, M(x) wedge B(x)$" makes the implication that all people ($x$) are both male ($M(x)$) and have brown hair ($B(x)$). However, we know there are also women among the $x$'s, so that doesn't work out does it?
It's not as overt as saying "$x$ implies $y$," and in the nuances of the English one would look at them as being logically equivalent; it took me a while to even notice myself the nuance. This is probably where your confusion comes from.
add a comment |
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
It's ultimately a matter of what you're trying to imply.
To say there are some men with brown hair means that both conditions hold true; there exists a person who is both male ($M(x)$) and has brown hair ($B(x)$).
However, think about what it says to say "all men have brown hair." "All men have" is basically saying "$M(x) Rightarrow text{(something)}$". To say "all men have" something is making an ever-so-subtle assumption that being a man implies something.
Another problem with the use of the "and" operator here is the subtle assumption that the $x$'s you're dealing with are people. To say "$forall x, M(x) wedge B(x)$" makes the implication that all people ($x$) are both male ($M(x)$) and have brown hair ($B(x)$). However, we know there are also women among the $x$'s, so that doesn't work out does it?
It's not as overt as saying "$x$ implies $y$," and in the nuances of the English one would look at them as being logically equivalent; it took me a while to even notice myself the nuance. This is probably where your confusion comes from.
It's ultimately a matter of what you're trying to imply.
To say there are some men with brown hair means that both conditions hold true; there exists a person who is both male ($M(x)$) and has brown hair ($B(x)$).
However, think about what it says to say "all men have brown hair." "All men have" is basically saying "$M(x) Rightarrow text{(something)}$". To say "all men have" something is making an ever-so-subtle assumption that being a man implies something.
Another problem with the use of the "and" operator here is the subtle assumption that the $x$'s you're dealing with are people. To say "$forall x, M(x) wedge B(x)$" makes the implication that all people ($x$) are both male ($M(x)$) and have brown hair ($B(x)$). However, we know there are also women among the $x$'s, so that doesn't work out does it?
It's not as overt as saying "$x$ implies $y$," and in the nuances of the English one would look at them as being logically equivalent; it took me a while to even notice myself the nuance. This is probably where your confusion comes from.
answered Nov 26 at 6:17
Eevee Trainer
2,614221
2,614221
add a comment |
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That depends on what your domain is. If your domain is the set of all people then the statement $forall xleft( M(x)wedge B(x)right)$ translates as "Every person is a male with brown hair." You have seemingly ignored the possibilities of females being present too.
– JMoravitz
Nov 26 at 6:14