Shoe-socks property [closed]












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Is it true that for every group $(G,*)$ and any $a,bin G$, $$(a*b)^{-1}=b^{-1}*a^{-1} ;;?$$ Why, or why not?










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closed as off-topic by Shaun, KReiser, Cesareo, Paul Plummer, Chinnapparaj R Nov 29 at 6:43


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    Is it true that for every group $(G,*)$ and any $a,bin G$, $$(a*b)^{-1}=b^{-1}*a^{-1} ;;?$$ Why, or why not?










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    closed as off-topic by Shaun, KReiser, Cesareo, Paul Plummer, Chinnapparaj R Nov 29 at 6:43


    This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:


    • "This question is missing context or other details: Please improve the question by providing additional context, which ideally includes your thoughts on the problem and any attempts you have made to solve it. This information helps others identify where you have difficulties and helps them write answers appropriate to your experience level." – Shaun, KReiser, Cesareo, Paul Plummer, Chinnapparaj R

    If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
















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      Is it true that for every group $(G,*)$ and any $a,bin G$, $$(a*b)^{-1}=b^{-1}*a^{-1} ;;?$$ Why, or why not?










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      Is it true that for every group $(G,*)$ and any $a,bin G$, $$(a*b)^{-1}=b^{-1}*a^{-1} ;;?$$ Why, or why not?







      group-theory inverse






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      edited Nov 29 at 6:43









      Chinnapparaj R

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      5,2251826










      asked Jun 11 '14 at 14:36









      HaloKiller

      208312




      208312




      closed as off-topic by Shaun, KReiser, Cesareo, Paul Plummer, Chinnapparaj R Nov 29 at 6:43


      This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:


      • "This question is missing context or other details: Please improve the question by providing additional context, which ideally includes your thoughts on the problem and any attempts you have made to solve it. This information helps others identify where you have difficulties and helps them write answers appropriate to your experience level." – Shaun, KReiser, Cesareo, Paul Plummer, Chinnapparaj R

      If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.




      closed as off-topic by Shaun, KReiser, Cesareo, Paul Plummer, Chinnapparaj R Nov 29 at 6:43


      This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:


      • "This question is missing context or other details: Please improve the question by providing additional context, which ideally includes your thoughts on the problem and any attempts you have made to solve it. This information helps others identify where you have difficulties and helps them write answers appropriate to your experience level." – Shaun, KReiser, Cesareo, Paul Plummer, Chinnapparaj R

      If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.






















          6 Answers
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          3














          $$(a*b)*(b^{-1}a^{-1}) = a*(b*b^{-1})*a^{-1} = a*e*a^{-1} = a*a^{-1} = e$$



          And likewise $(b^{-1}a^{-1})*(a * b) = e$.



          So with associativity of the operation in a group, and by the mere definitions of inverse elements in a group, $$(a*b)^{-1} = b^{-1}a^{-1}$$






          share|cite|improve this answer





























            1














            This is true because $(a ast b) ast (b^{-1} ast a^{-1}) = a ast b ast b^{-1} ast a^{-1} = a ast e ast a^{-1} = a ast a^{-1} = e$. We used that multiplication is associative.






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              1














              It is true, because of associativity: $$(ab)(b^{-1}a^{-1})=a(bb^{-1})a^{-1}=a*e*a^{-1}=e \(b^{-1}a^{-1})ab=b^{-1}(a^{-1}a)b=b^{-1}*e*b=e.$$






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                1














                Suppose $a$ and $b$ are symmetries of some underlying object $X$. (All group elements can be understood in this way.) Then $ab$ is the composition of $a$ and $b$, which means that it is the transformation of $X$ that results when you first transform $X$ with transformation $a$, and then transform the result with transformation $b$.



                Now suppose you would like to undo the transformation of $X$ that you have just done with $ab$. You must first undo $b$, then undo $a$. The transformation that undoes $b$ is exactly $b^{-1}$, and the transformation that undoes $a$ is $a^{-1}$. To undo $b$ and then $a$, in that order we compose these, in order, first $b^{-1}$ then $a^{-1}$. So the transformation that undoes $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$.






                share|cite|improve this answer































                  0














                  All the answers so far have shown that $(aast b)ast(b^{-1}ast a^{-1}) = (b^{-1}ast a^{-1})ast(aast b) = e$ so $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$. Of course this is completely valid, but it may be hard to see where the expression $b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$ came from.



                  Let $x$ be the inverse of $aast b$. Then we have



                  begin{align*}
                  (aast b)ast x &= e\
                  aast(bast x) &= e\
                  a^{-1}ast(aast(bast x)) &= a^{-1}ast e\
                  (a^{-1}ast a)ast(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                  east(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                  bast x &= a^{-1}\
                  b^{-1}ast(bast x) &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                  (b^{-1}ast b)ast x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                  east x & = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                  x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}.
                  end{align*}



                  By uniqueness of the inverse element, or by verification as in the other answers, $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$.






                  share|cite|improve this answer





























                    0














                    You claim that the inverse of $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$. Then just multiply it and see what happens. Notice that inverses are unique in a group.






                    share|cite|improve this answer






























                      6 Answers
                      6






                      active

                      oldest

                      votes








                      6 Answers
                      6






                      active

                      oldest

                      votes









                      active

                      oldest

                      votes






                      active

                      oldest

                      votes









                      3














                      $$(a*b)*(b^{-1}a^{-1}) = a*(b*b^{-1})*a^{-1} = a*e*a^{-1} = a*a^{-1} = e$$



                      And likewise $(b^{-1}a^{-1})*(a * b) = e$.



                      So with associativity of the operation in a group, and by the mere definitions of inverse elements in a group, $$(a*b)^{-1} = b^{-1}a^{-1}$$






                      share|cite|improve this answer


























                        3














                        $$(a*b)*(b^{-1}a^{-1}) = a*(b*b^{-1})*a^{-1} = a*e*a^{-1} = a*a^{-1} = e$$



                        And likewise $(b^{-1}a^{-1})*(a * b) = e$.



                        So with associativity of the operation in a group, and by the mere definitions of inverse elements in a group, $$(a*b)^{-1} = b^{-1}a^{-1}$$






                        share|cite|improve this answer
























                          3












                          3








                          3






                          $$(a*b)*(b^{-1}a^{-1}) = a*(b*b^{-1})*a^{-1} = a*e*a^{-1} = a*a^{-1} = e$$



                          And likewise $(b^{-1}a^{-1})*(a * b) = e$.



                          So with associativity of the operation in a group, and by the mere definitions of inverse elements in a group, $$(a*b)^{-1} = b^{-1}a^{-1}$$






                          share|cite|improve this answer












                          $$(a*b)*(b^{-1}a^{-1}) = a*(b*b^{-1})*a^{-1} = a*e*a^{-1} = a*a^{-1} = e$$



                          And likewise $(b^{-1}a^{-1})*(a * b) = e$.



                          So with associativity of the operation in a group, and by the mere definitions of inverse elements in a group, $$(a*b)^{-1} = b^{-1}a^{-1}$$







                          share|cite|improve this answer












                          share|cite|improve this answer



                          share|cite|improve this answer










                          answered Jun 11 '14 at 14:40









                          amWhy

                          191k28224439




                          191k28224439























                              1














                              This is true because $(a ast b) ast (b^{-1} ast a^{-1}) = a ast b ast b^{-1} ast a^{-1} = a ast e ast a^{-1} = a ast a^{-1} = e$. We used that multiplication is associative.






                              share|cite|improve this answer


























                                1














                                This is true because $(a ast b) ast (b^{-1} ast a^{-1}) = a ast b ast b^{-1} ast a^{-1} = a ast e ast a^{-1} = a ast a^{-1} = e$. We used that multiplication is associative.






                                share|cite|improve this answer
























                                  1












                                  1








                                  1






                                  This is true because $(a ast b) ast (b^{-1} ast a^{-1}) = a ast b ast b^{-1} ast a^{-1} = a ast e ast a^{-1} = a ast a^{-1} = e$. We used that multiplication is associative.






                                  share|cite|improve this answer












                                  This is true because $(a ast b) ast (b^{-1} ast a^{-1}) = a ast b ast b^{-1} ast a^{-1} = a ast e ast a^{-1} = a ast a^{-1} = e$. We used that multiplication is associative.







                                  share|cite|improve this answer












                                  share|cite|improve this answer



                                  share|cite|improve this answer










                                  answered Jun 11 '14 at 14:39









                                  user133281

                                  13.6k22551




                                  13.6k22551























                                      1














                                      It is true, because of associativity: $$(ab)(b^{-1}a^{-1})=a(bb^{-1})a^{-1}=a*e*a^{-1}=e \(b^{-1}a^{-1})ab=b^{-1}(a^{-1}a)b=b^{-1}*e*b=e.$$






                                      share|cite|improve this answer


























                                        1














                                        It is true, because of associativity: $$(ab)(b^{-1}a^{-1})=a(bb^{-1})a^{-1}=a*e*a^{-1}=e \(b^{-1}a^{-1})ab=b^{-1}(a^{-1}a)b=b^{-1}*e*b=e.$$






                                        share|cite|improve this answer
























                                          1












                                          1








                                          1






                                          It is true, because of associativity: $$(ab)(b^{-1}a^{-1})=a(bb^{-1})a^{-1}=a*e*a^{-1}=e \(b^{-1}a^{-1})ab=b^{-1}(a^{-1}a)b=b^{-1}*e*b=e.$$






                                          share|cite|improve this answer












                                          It is true, because of associativity: $$(ab)(b^{-1}a^{-1})=a(bb^{-1})a^{-1}=a*e*a^{-1}=e \(b^{-1}a^{-1})ab=b^{-1}(a^{-1}a)b=b^{-1}*e*b=e.$$







                                          share|cite|improve this answer












                                          share|cite|improve this answer



                                          share|cite|improve this answer










                                          answered Jun 11 '14 at 14:40









                                          user1337

                                          16.5k43391




                                          16.5k43391























                                              1














                                              Suppose $a$ and $b$ are symmetries of some underlying object $X$. (All group elements can be understood in this way.) Then $ab$ is the composition of $a$ and $b$, which means that it is the transformation of $X$ that results when you first transform $X$ with transformation $a$, and then transform the result with transformation $b$.



                                              Now suppose you would like to undo the transformation of $X$ that you have just done with $ab$. You must first undo $b$, then undo $a$. The transformation that undoes $b$ is exactly $b^{-1}$, and the transformation that undoes $a$ is $a^{-1}$. To undo $b$ and then $a$, in that order we compose these, in order, first $b^{-1}$ then $a^{-1}$. So the transformation that undoes $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$.






                                              share|cite|improve this answer




























                                                1














                                                Suppose $a$ and $b$ are symmetries of some underlying object $X$. (All group elements can be understood in this way.) Then $ab$ is the composition of $a$ and $b$, which means that it is the transformation of $X$ that results when you first transform $X$ with transformation $a$, and then transform the result with transformation $b$.



                                                Now suppose you would like to undo the transformation of $X$ that you have just done with $ab$. You must first undo $b$, then undo $a$. The transformation that undoes $b$ is exactly $b^{-1}$, and the transformation that undoes $a$ is $a^{-1}$. To undo $b$ and then $a$, in that order we compose these, in order, first $b^{-1}$ then $a^{-1}$. So the transformation that undoes $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$.






                                                share|cite|improve this answer


























                                                  1












                                                  1








                                                  1






                                                  Suppose $a$ and $b$ are symmetries of some underlying object $X$. (All group elements can be understood in this way.) Then $ab$ is the composition of $a$ and $b$, which means that it is the transformation of $X$ that results when you first transform $X$ with transformation $a$, and then transform the result with transformation $b$.



                                                  Now suppose you would like to undo the transformation of $X$ that you have just done with $ab$. You must first undo $b$, then undo $a$. The transformation that undoes $b$ is exactly $b^{-1}$, and the transformation that undoes $a$ is $a^{-1}$. To undo $b$ and then $a$, in that order we compose these, in order, first $b^{-1}$ then $a^{-1}$. So the transformation that undoes $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$.






                                                  share|cite|improve this answer














                                                  Suppose $a$ and $b$ are symmetries of some underlying object $X$. (All group elements can be understood in this way.) Then $ab$ is the composition of $a$ and $b$, which means that it is the transformation of $X$ that results when you first transform $X$ with transformation $a$, and then transform the result with transformation $b$.



                                                  Now suppose you would like to undo the transformation of $X$ that you have just done with $ab$. You must first undo $b$, then undo $a$. The transformation that undoes $b$ is exactly $b^{-1}$, and the transformation that undoes $a$ is $a^{-1}$. To undo $b$ and then $a$, in that order we compose these, in order, first $b^{-1}$ then $a^{-1}$. So the transformation that undoes $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$.







                                                  share|cite|improve this answer














                                                  share|cite|improve this answer



                                                  share|cite|improve this answer








                                                  answered Jun 11 '14 at 15:02


























                                                  community wiki





                                                  MJD
























                                                      0














                                                      All the answers so far have shown that $(aast b)ast(b^{-1}ast a^{-1}) = (b^{-1}ast a^{-1})ast(aast b) = e$ so $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$. Of course this is completely valid, but it may be hard to see where the expression $b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$ came from.



                                                      Let $x$ be the inverse of $aast b$. Then we have



                                                      begin{align*}
                                                      (aast b)ast x &= e\
                                                      aast(bast x) &= e\
                                                      a^{-1}ast(aast(bast x)) &= a^{-1}ast e\
                                                      (a^{-1}ast a)ast(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                      east(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                      bast x &= a^{-1}\
                                                      b^{-1}ast(bast x) &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                      (b^{-1}ast b)ast x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                      east x & = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                      x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}.
                                                      end{align*}



                                                      By uniqueness of the inverse element, or by verification as in the other answers, $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$.






                                                      share|cite|improve this answer


























                                                        0














                                                        All the answers so far have shown that $(aast b)ast(b^{-1}ast a^{-1}) = (b^{-1}ast a^{-1})ast(aast b) = e$ so $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$. Of course this is completely valid, but it may be hard to see where the expression $b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$ came from.



                                                        Let $x$ be the inverse of $aast b$. Then we have



                                                        begin{align*}
                                                        (aast b)ast x &= e\
                                                        aast(bast x) &= e\
                                                        a^{-1}ast(aast(bast x)) &= a^{-1}ast e\
                                                        (a^{-1}ast a)ast(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                        east(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                        bast x &= a^{-1}\
                                                        b^{-1}ast(bast x) &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                        (b^{-1}ast b)ast x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                        east x & = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                        x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}.
                                                        end{align*}



                                                        By uniqueness of the inverse element, or by verification as in the other answers, $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$.






                                                        share|cite|improve this answer
























                                                          0












                                                          0








                                                          0






                                                          All the answers so far have shown that $(aast b)ast(b^{-1}ast a^{-1}) = (b^{-1}ast a^{-1})ast(aast b) = e$ so $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$. Of course this is completely valid, but it may be hard to see where the expression $b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$ came from.



                                                          Let $x$ be the inverse of $aast b$. Then we have



                                                          begin{align*}
                                                          (aast b)ast x &= e\
                                                          aast(bast x) &= e\
                                                          a^{-1}ast(aast(bast x)) &= a^{-1}ast e\
                                                          (a^{-1}ast a)ast(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                          east(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                          bast x &= a^{-1}\
                                                          b^{-1}ast(bast x) &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                          (b^{-1}ast b)ast x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                          east x & = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                          x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}.
                                                          end{align*}



                                                          By uniqueness of the inverse element, or by verification as in the other answers, $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$.






                                                          share|cite|improve this answer












                                                          All the answers so far have shown that $(aast b)ast(b^{-1}ast a^{-1}) = (b^{-1}ast a^{-1})ast(aast b) = e$ so $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$. Of course this is completely valid, but it may be hard to see where the expression $b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$ came from.



                                                          Let $x$ be the inverse of $aast b$. Then we have



                                                          begin{align*}
                                                          (aast b)ast x &= e\
                                                          aast(bast x) &= e\
                                                          a^{-1}ast(aast(bast x)) &= a^{-1}ast e\
                                                          (a^{-1}ast a)ast(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                          east(bast x) &= a^{-1}\
                                                          bast x &= a^{-1}\
                                                          b^{-1}ast(bast x) &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                          (b^{-1}ast b)ast x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                          east x & = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}\
                                                          x &= b^{-1}ast a^{-1}.
                                                          end{align*}



                                                          By uniqueness of the inverse element, or by verification as in the other answers, $(aast b)^{-1} = b^{-1}ast a^{-1}$.







                                                          share|cite|improve this answer












                                                          share|cite|improve this answer



                                                          share|cite|improve this answer










                                                          answered Jun 11 '14 at 14:56









                                                          Michael Albanese

                                                          62.9k1598302




                                                          62.9k1598302























                                                              0














                                                              You claim that the inverse of $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$. Then just multiply it and see what happens. Notice that inverses are unique in a group.






                                                              share|cite|improve this answer




























                                                                0














                                                                You claim that the inverse of $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$. Then just multiply it and see what happens. Notice that inverses are unique in a group.






                                                                share|cite|improve this answer


























                                                                  0












                                                                  0








                                                                  0






                                                                  You claim that the inverse of $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$. Then just multiply it and see what happens. Notice that inverses are unique in a group.






                                                                  share|cite|improve this answer














                                                                  You claim that the inverse of $ab$ is $b^{-1}a^{-1}$. Then just multiply it and see what happens. Notice that inverses are unique in a group.







                                                                  share|cite|improve this answer














                                                                  share|cite|improve this answer



                                                                  share|cite|improve this answer








                                                                  edited Dec 14 '14 at 15:27









                                                                  Michael Albanese

                                                                  62.9k1598302




                                                                  62.9k1598302










                                                                  answered Jun 11 '14 at 14:50









                                                                  Daniel Valenzuela

                                                                  5,384718




                                                                  5,384718















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