Suppose that $f_nto f$ and $g_nto g$, as $nto infty,$ uniformly. Then, $f_n g_nto fg,$ as $nto infty,$...
$begingroup$
Can you, please, check if the following proof is correct? Thanks for your time and effort.
Suppose that $f_nto f$ and $g_nto g$, as $nto infty,$ uniformly on $Esubseteq Bbb{R}.$ Then, $f_n g_nto fg,$ as $nto infty,$ pointwise on $E$.
Let $epsilon>0$ be given and $xin E$ be fixed. Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)+f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&leq left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)right| + left|f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right| end{align}
The sequences ${f_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ and ${g_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ are real sequences that converge to $f(x)$ and $g(x)$, respectively. So, they are bounded, i.e., for fixed $xin E,$ there exists $M>0$ and $K>0,$ such that begin{align}left|f_n(x)right| leq M;text{and};left|g_n(x)right| leq K,;forall ;ninBbb{N}.end{align}
Therefore,
begin{align}limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}left|g_n(x)right| =left|limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}g_n(x)right|=left|g(x)right|leq K.end{align}
So, we have begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|end{align}
Since $f_n(x)to f(x)$ and $g_n(x)to g(x)$, as $nto infty,$ for fixed $xin E$, then there exists $N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)$ such that
begin{align} left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2K} ,;;forall;ngeq N_1(epsilon)end{align}
and begin{align} left|g_n(x)-g(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2M } ,;;forall;ngeq N_2(epsilon)end{align}
Let $N(epsilon)=max{N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)}.$ Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&<dfrac{epsilon}{2 } +dfrac{epsilon}{2 }=epsilon,;;forall;ngeq N(epsilon)end{align}
real-analysis analysis convergence pointwise-convergence
$endgroup$
|
show 4 more comments
$begingroup$
Can you, please, check if the following proof is correct? Thanks for your time and effort.
Suppose that $f_nto f$ and $g_nto g$, as $nto infty,$ uniformly on $Esubseteq Bbb{R}.$ Then, $f_n g_nto fg,$ as $nto infty,$ pointwise on $E$.
Let $epsilon>0$ be given and $xin E$ be fixed. Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)+f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&leq left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)right| + left|f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right| end{align}
The sequences ${f_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ and ${g_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ are real sequences that converge to $f(x)$ and $g(x)$, respectively. So, they are bounded, i.e., for fixed $xin E,$ there exists $M>0$ and $K>0,$ such that begin{align}left|f_n(x)right| leq M;text{and};left|g_n(x)right| leq K,;forall ;ninBbb{N}.end{align}
Therefore,
begin{align}limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}left|g_n(x)right| =left|limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}g_n(x)right|=left|g(x)right|leq K.end{align}
So, we have begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|end{align}
Since $f_n(x)to f(x)$ and $g_n(x)to g(x)$, as $nto infty,$ for fixed $xin E$, then there exists $N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)$ such that
begin{align} left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2K} ,;;forall;ngeq N_1(epsilon)end{align}
and begin{align} left|g_n(x)-g(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2M } ,;;forall;ngeq N_2(epsilon)end{align}
Let $N(epsilon)=max{N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)}.$ Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&<dfrac{epsilon}{2 } +dfrac{epsilon}{2 }=epsilon,;;forall;ngeq N(epsilon)end{align}
real-analysis analysis convergence pointwise-convergence
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Your notation can be eased tremendously if you give $sup|f_n(x)|$ a name, and avoid the big fractions by worrying about shrinking $epsilon$ towards the end.
$endgroup$
– John Jiang
Dec 29 '18 at 20:19
$begingroup$
@ John Jiang: Thanks for that advice. Will fix it!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:20
$begingroup$
Since $f_n$ and $g_n$ converge uniformly, your $|cdot|$ should be the sup-norm w.r.t. $x$. Thus your $N$ should only depend on $epsilon$ not $x$.
$endgroup$
– induction601
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
1
$begingroup$
I think that you don't need the uniform convergence of $f_n$ and $g_n$ for $(f_ntimes g_n)(x)$ to converge to $(f times g)(x)$ pointwise. Moreover, isn't the important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence the fact that you can choose $N$ such that it depends only on epsilon and not on $x$? In other words, you haven't used uniform convergence in your argument.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
$begingroup$
@stressed out: Thanks!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:26
|
show 4 more comments
$begingroup$
Can you, please, check if the following proof is correct? Thanks for your time and effort.
Suppose that $f_nto f$ and $g_nto g$, as $nto infty,$ uniformly on $Esubseteq Bbb{R}.$ Then, $f_n g_nto fg,$ as $nto infty,$ pointwise on $E$.
Let $epsilon>0$ be given and $xin E$ be fixed. Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)+f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&leq left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)right| + left|f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right| end{align}
The sequences ${f_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ and ${g_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ are real sequences that converge to $f(x)$ and $g(x)$, respectively. So, they are bounded, i.e., for fixed $xin E,$ there exists $M>0$ and $K>0,$ such that begin{align}left|f_n(x)right| leq M;text{and};left|g_n(x)right| leq K,;forall ;ninBbb{N}.end{align}
Therefore,
begin{align}limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}left|g_n(x)right| =left|limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}g_n(x)right|=left|g(x)right|leq K.end{align}
So, we have begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|end{align}
Since $f_n(x)to f(x)$ and $g_n(x)to g(x)$, as $nto infty,$ for fixed $xin E$, then there exists $N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)$ such that
begin{align} left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2K} ,;;forall;ngeq N_1(epsilon)end{align}
and begin{align} left|g_n(x)-g(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2M } ,;;forall;ngeq N_2(epsilon)end{align}
Let $N(epsilon)=max{N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)}.$ Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&<dfrac{epsilon}{2 } +dfrac{epsilon}{2 }=epsilon,;;forall;ngeq N(epsilon)end{align}
real-analysis analysis convergence pointwise-convergence
$endgroup$
Can you, please, check if the following proof is correct? Thanks for your time and effort.
Suppose that $f_nto f$ and $g_nto g$, as $nto infty,$ uniformly on $Esubseteq Bbb{R}.$ Then, $f_n g_nto fg,$ as $nto infty,$ pointwise on $E$.
Let $epsilon>0$ be given and $xin E$ be fixed. Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)+f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&leq left|f_n(x) g_n(x)-f_n(x) g(x)right| + left|f_n(x) g(x)-f(x) g(x)right| \&= left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right| end{align}
The sequences ${f_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ and ${g_n(x) }_{ninBbb{N}}$ are real sequences that converge to $f(x)$ and $g(x)$, respectively. So, they are bounded, i.e., for fixed $xin E,$ there exists $M>0$ and $K>0,$ such that begin{align}left|f_n(x)right| leq M;text{and};left|g_n(x)right| leq K,;forall ;ninBbb{N}.end{align}
Therefore,
begin{align}limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}left|g_n(x)right| =left|limlimits_{ninBbb{N}}g_n(x)right|=left|g(x)right|leq K.end{align}
So, we have begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq left|f_n(x)right| left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + left|g(x)right| left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|end{align}
Since $f_n(x)to f(x)$ and $g_n(x)to g(x)$, as $nto infty,$ for fixed $xin E$, then there exists $N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)$ such that
begin{align} left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2K} ,;;forall;ngeq N_1(epsilon)end{align}
and begin{align} left|g_n(x)-g(x) right|<dfrac{epsilon}{2M } ,;;forall;ngeq N_2(epsilon)end{align}
Let $N(epsilon)=max{N_1(epsilon),N_2(epsilon)}.$ Then,
begin{align} left|(f_n g_n)(x)-(f g)(x)right| &leq M left|g_n(x)- g(x)right| + K left|f_n(x)-f(x) right|\&<dfrac{epsilon}{2 } +dfrac{epsilon}{2 }=epsilon,;;forall;ngeq N(epsilon)end{align}
real-analysis analysis convergence pointwise-convergence
real-analysis analysis convergence pointwise-convergence
edited Dec 29 '18 at 21:13
Omojola Micheal
asked Dec 29 '18 at 20:16
Omojola MichealOmojola Micheal
1,986324
1,986324
$begingroup$
Your notation can be eased tremendously if you give $sup|f_n(x)|$ a name, and avoid the big fractions by worrying about shrinking $epsilon$ towards the end.
$endgroup$
– John Jiang
Dec 29 '18 at 20:19
$begingroup$
@ John Jiang: Thanks for that advice. Will fix it!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:20
$begingroup$
Since $f_n$ and $g_n$ converge uniformly, your $|cdot|$ should be the sup-norm w.r.t. $x$. Thus your $N$ should only depend on $epsilon$ not $x$.
$endgroup$
– induction601
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
1
$begingroup$
I think that you don't need the uniform convergence of $f_n$ and $g_n$ for $(f_ntimes g_n)(x)$ to converge to $(f times g)(x)$ pointwise. Moreover, isn't the important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence the fact that you can choose $N$ such that it depends only on epsilon and not on $x$? In other words, you haven't used uniform convergence in your argument.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
$begingroup$
@stressed out: Thanks!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:26
|
show 4 more comments
$begingroup$
Your notation can be eased tremendously if you give $sup|f_n(x)|$ a name, and avoid the big fractions by worrying about shrinking $epsilon$ towards the end.
$endgroup$
– John Jiang
Dec 29 '18 at 20:19
$begingroup$
@ John Jiang: Thanks for that advice. Will fix it!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:20
$begingroup$
Since $f_n$ and $g_n$ converge uniformly, your $|cdot|$ should be the sup-norm w.r.t. $x$. Thus your $N$ should only depend on $epsilon$ not $x$.
$endgroup$
– induction601
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
1
$begingroup$
I think that you don't need the uniform convergence of $f_n$ and $g_n$ for $(f_ntimes g_n)(x)$ to converge to $(f times g)(x)$ pointwise. Moreover, isn't the important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence the fact that you can choose $N$ such that it depends only on epsilon and not on $x$? In other words, you haven't used uniform convergence in your argument.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
$begingroup$
@stressed out: Thanks!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:26
$begingroup$
Your notation can be eased tremendously if you give $sup|f_n(x)|$ a name, and avoid the big fractions by worrying about shrinking $epsilon$ towards the end.
$endgroup$
– John Jiang
Dec 29 '18 at 20:19
$begingroup$
Your notation can be eased tremendously if you give $sup|f_n(x)|$ a name, and avoid the big fractions by worrying about shrinking $epsilon$ towards the end.
$endgroup$
– John Jiang
Dec 29 '18 at 20:19
$begingroup$
@ John Jiang: Thanks for that advice. Will fix it!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:20
$begingroup$
@ John Jiang: Thanks for that advice. Will fix it!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:20
$begingroup$
Since $f_n$ and $g_n$ converge uniformly, your $|cdot|$ should be the sup-norm w.r.t. $x$. Thus your $N$ should only depend on $epsilon$ not $x$.
$endgroup$
– induction601
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
$begingroup$
Since $f_n$ and $g_n$ converge uniformly, your $|cdot|$ should be the sup-norm w.r.t. $x$. Thus your $N$ should only depend on $epsilon$ not $x$.
$endgroup$
– induction601
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
1
1
$begingroup$
I think that you don't need the uniform convergence of $f_n$ and $g_n$ for $(f_ntimes g_n)(x)$ to converge to $(f times g)(x)$ pointwise. Moreover, isn't the important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence the fact that you can choose $N$ such that it depends only on epsilon and not on $x$? In other words, you haven't used uniform convergence in your argument.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
$begingroup$
I think that you don't need the uniform convergence of $f_n$ and $g_n$ for $(f_ntimes g_n)(x)$ to converge to $(f times g)(x)$ pointwise. Moreover, isn't the important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence the fact that you can choose $N$ such that it depends only on epsilon and not on $x$? In other words, you haven't used uniform convergence in your argument.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
$begingroup$
@stressed out: Thanks!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:26
$begingroup$
@stressed out: Thanks!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:26
|
show 4 more comments
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
As I mentioned in the comments, you have not used the uniform convergence of $f_n$ or $g_n$ in your argument. And in fact, it is not necessary for your statement to hold. The important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence is that the later is global in the sense that the $N$ you find depends only on $epsilon$ and not on $x$. Geometrically, suppose that $f_n to f$ uniformly. Then, consider the graph of $f$ engulfed by $f+epsilon$ and $f-epsilon$. Picture this like a cylinder of radius $epsilon$ wrapped around $f$ at each point of its domain entirely.
When the convergence is uniform, after a certain $N$, all $f_n$'s will be contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood globally for $n geq N$. When the convergence is not uniform, no matter what $N$ is, some $f_n$'s will not be completely contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood. This is the geometric idea. In other words, the cylinder wrapped around $f$ might get wider or narrower around some points to contain $f_n$'s. It won't look uniform to us anymore.
In your case, your theorem is implied by the following simple theorem about real sequences:
$$lim_{ntoinfty} a_n times lim_{ntoinfty} b_n = lim_{ntoinfty} a_ntimes b_n$$
where $a_n$ and $b_n$ are real sequences. Note that for any $x$, $f_n(x)$ and $g_n(x)$ are real sequences. Now try to continue your reasoning from here.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Alright, I'll work on that!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:42
$begingroup$
@Mike Yes. It's better now. Why don't you use the same boundedness argument for $g_n$ as well? Your argument is correct anyway, but since the question asks you to assume that $f_n$ and $g_n$ are uniformly convergent, you might want to emphasize that $N$ can be chosen as a function of only $epsilon$. Even though your argument is correct anyway.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:01
1
$begingroup$
All $N$'s now depend only on $epsilon.$ Thanks for your comments and help!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 21:17
$begingroup$
@Mike It's correct now. You're welcome.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:20
add a comment |
Your Answer
StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function () {
return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function () {
StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix) {
StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
});
});
}, "mathjax-editing");
StackExchange.ready(function() {
var channelOptions = {
tags: "".split(" "),
id: "69"
};
initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);
StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function() {
// Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled) {
StackExchange.using("snippets", function() {
createEditor();
});
}
else {
createEditor();
}
});
function createEditor() {
StackExchange.prepareEditor({
heartbeatType: 'answer',
autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
convertImagesToLinks: true,
noModals: true,
showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
reputationToPostImages: 10,
bindNavPrevention: true,
postfix: "",
imageUploader: {
brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
allowUrls: true
},
noCode: true, onDemand: true,
discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
});
}
});
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3056212%2fsuppose-that-f-n-to-f-and-g-n-to-g-as-n-to-infty-uniformly-then-f-n%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
As I mentioned in the comments, you have not used the uniform convergence of $f_n$ or $g_n$ in your argument. And in fact, it is not necessary for your statement to hold. The important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence is that the later is global in the sense that the $N$ you find depends only on $epsilon$ and not on $x$. Geometrically, suppose that $f_n to f$ uniformly. Then, consider the graph of $f$ engulfed by $f+epsilon$ and $f-epsilon$. Picture this like a cylinder of radius $epsilon$ wrapped around $f$ at each point of its domain entirely.
When the convergence is uniform, after a certain $N$, all $f_n$'s will be contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood globally for $n geq N$. When the convergence is not uniform, no matter what $N$ is, some $f_n$'s will not be completely contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood. This is the geometric idea. In other words, the cylinder wrapped around $f$ might get wider or narrower around some points to contain $f_n$'s. It won't look uniform to us anymore.
In your case, your theorem is implied by the following simple theorem about real sequences:
$$lim_{ntoinfty} a_n times lim_{ntoinfty} b_n = lim_{ntoinfty} a_ntimes b_n$$
where $a_n$ and $b_n$ are real sequences. Note that for any $x$, $f_n(x)$ and $g_n(x)$ are real sequences. Now try to continue your reasoning from here.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Alright, I'll work on that!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:42
$begingroup$
@Mike Yes. It's better now. Why don't you use the same boundedness argument for $g_n$ as well? Your argument is correct anyway, but since the question asks you to assume that $f_n$ and $g_n$ are uniformly convergent, you might want to emphasize that $N$ can be chosen as a function of only $epsilon$. Even though your argument is correct anyway.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:01
1
$begingroup$
All $N$'s now depend only on $epsilon.$ Thanks for your comments and help!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 21:17
$begingroup$
@Mike It's correct now. You're welcome.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:20
add a comment |
$begingroup$
As I mentioned in the comments, you have not used the uniform convergence of $f_n$ or $g_n$ in your argument. And in fact, it is not necessary for your statement to hold. The important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence is that the later is global in the sense that the $N$ you find depends only on $epsilon$ and not on $x$. Geometrically, suppose that $f_n to f$ uniformly. Then, consider the graph of $f$ engulfed by $f+epsilon$ and $f-epsilon$. Picture this like a cylinder of radius $epsilon$ wrapped around $f$ at each point of its domain entirely.
When the convergence is uniform, after a certain $N$, all $f_n$'s will be contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood globally for $n geq N$. When the convergence is not uniform, no matter what $N$ is, some $f_n$'s will not be completely contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood. This is the geometric idea. In other words, the cylinder wrapped around $f$ might get wider or narrower around some points to contain $f_n$'s. It won't look uniform to us anymore.
In your case, your theorem is implied by the following simple theorem about real sequences:
$$lim_{ntoinfty} a_n times lim_{ntoinfty} b_n = lim_{ntoinfty} a_ntimes b_n$$
where $a_n$ and $b_n$ are real sequences. Note that for any $x$, $f_n(x)$ and $g_n(x)$ are real sequences. Now try to continue your reasoning from here.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Alright, I'll work on that!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:42
$begingroup$
@Mike Yes. It's better now. Why don't you use the same boundedness argument for $g_n$ as well? Your argument is correct anyway, but since the question asks you to assume that $f_n$ and $g_n$ are uniformly convergent, you might want to emphasize that $N$ can be chosen as a function of only $epsilon$. Even though your argument is correct anyway.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:01
1
$begingroup$
All $N$'s now depend only on $epsilon.$ Thanks for your comments and help!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 21:17
$begingroup$
@Mike It's correct now. You're welcome.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:20
add a comment |
$begingroup$
As I mentioned in the comments, you have not used the uniform convergence of $f_n$ or $g_n$ in your argument. And in fact, it is not necessary for your statement to hold. The important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence is that the later is global in the sense that the $N$ you find depends only on $epsilon$ and not on $x$. Geometrically, suppose that $f_n to f$ uniformly. Then, consider the graph of $f$ engulfed by $f+epsilon$ and $f-epsilon$. Picture this like a cylinder of radius $epsilon$ wrapped around $f$ at each point of its domain entirely.
When the convergence is uniform, after a certain $N$, all $f_n$'s will be contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood globally for $n geq N$. When the convergence is not uniform, no matter what $N$ is, some $f_n$'s will not be completely contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood. This is the geometric idea. In other words, the cylinder wrapped around $f$ might get wider or narrower around some points to contain $f_n$'s. It won't look uniform to us anymore.
In your case, your theorem is implied by the following simple theorem about real sequences:
$$lim_{ntoinfty} a_n times lim_{ntoinfty} b_n = lim_{ntoinfty} a_ntimes b_n$$
where $a_n$ and $b_n$ are real sequences. Note that for any $x$, $f_n(x)$ and $g_n(x)$ are real sequences. Now try to continue your reasoning from here.
$endgroup$
As I mentioned in the comments, you have not used the uniform convergence of $f_n$ or $g_n$ in your argument. And in fact, it is not necessary for your statement to hold. The important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence is that the later is global in the sense that the $N$ you find depends only on $epsilon$ and not on $x$. Geometrically, suppose that $f_n to f$ uniformly. Then, consider the graph of $f$ engulfed by $f+epsilon$ and $f-epsilon$. Picture this like a cylinder of radius $epsilon$ wrapped around $f$ at each point of its domain entirely.
When the convergence is uniform, after a certain $N$, all $f_n$'s will be contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood globally for $n geq N$. When the convergence is not uniform, no matter what $N$ is, some $f_n$'s will not be completely contained in this tubular (cylindrical) neighborhood. This is the geometric idea. In other words, the cylinder wrapped around $f$ might get wider or narrower around some points to contain $f_n$'s. It won't look uniform to us anymore.
In your case, your theorem is implied by the following simple theorem about real sequences:
$$lim_{ntoinfty} a_n times lim_{ntoinfty} b_n = lim_{ntoinfty} a_ntimes b_n$$
where $a_n$ and $b_n$ are real sequences. Note that for any $x$, $f_n(x)$ and $g_n(x)$ are real sequences. Now try to continue your reasoning from here.
edited Dec 29 '18 at 20:43
answered Dec 29 '18 at 20:37
stressed outstressed out
6,5831939
6,5831939
$begingroup$
Alright, I'll work on that!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:42
$begingroup$
@Mike Yes. It's better now. Why don't you use the same boundedness argument for $g_n$ as well? Your argument is correct anyway, but since the question asks you to assume that $f_n$ and $g_n$ are uniformly convergent, you might want to emphasize that $N$ can be chosen as a function of only $epsilon$. Even though your argument is correct anyway.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:01
1
$begingroup$
All $N$'s now depend only on $epsilon.$ Thanks for your comments and help!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 21:17
$begingroup$
@Mike It's correct now. You're welcome.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:20
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Alright, I'll work on that!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:42
$begingroup$
@Mike Yes. It's better now. Why don't you use the same boundedness argument for $g_n$ as well? Your argument is correct anyway, but since the question asks you to assume that $f_n$ and $g_n$ are uniformly convergent, you might want to emphasize that $N$ can be chosen as a function of only $epsilon$. Even though your argument is correct anyway.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:01
1
$begingroup$
All $N$'s now depend only on $epsilon.$ Thanks for your comments and help!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 21:17
$begingroup$
@Mike It's correct now. You're welcome.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:20
$begingroup$
Alright, I'll work on that!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:42
$begingroup$
Alright, I'll work on that!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:42
$begingroup$
@Mike Yes. It's better now. Why don't you use the same boundedness argument for $g_n$ as well? Your argument is correct anyway, but since the question asks you to assume that $f_n$ and $g_n$ are uniformly convergent, you might want to emphasize that $N$ can be chosen as a function of only $epsilon$. Even though your argument is correct anyway.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:01
$begingroup$
@Mike Yes. It's better now. Why don't you use the same boundedness argument for $g_n$ as well? Your argument is correct anyway, but since the question asks you to assume that $f_n$ and $g_n$ are uniformly convergent, you might want to emphasize that $N$ can be chosen as a function of only $epsilon$. Even though your argument is correct anyway.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:01
1
1
$begingroup$
All $N$'s now depend only on $epsilon.$ Thanks for your comments and help!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 21:17
$begingroup$
All $N$'s now depend only on $epsilon.$ Thanks for your comments and help!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 21:17
$begingroup$
@Mike It's correct now. You're welcome.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:20
$begingroup$
@Mike It's correct now. You're welcome.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 21:20
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Mathematics Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f3056212%2fsuppose-that-f-n-to-f-and-g-n-to-g-as-n-to-infty-uniformly-then-f-n%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
$begingroup$
Your notation can be eased tremendously if you give $sup|f_n(x)|$ a name, and avoid the big fractions by worrying about shrinking $epsilon$ towards the end.
$endgroup$
– John Jiang
Dec 29 '18 at 20:19
$begingroup$
@ John Jiang: Thanks for that advice. Will fix it!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:20
$begingroup$
Since $f_n$ and $g_n$ converge uniformly, your $|cdot|$ should be the sup-norm w.r.t. $x$. Thus your $N$ should only depend on $epsilon$ not $x$.
$endgroup$
– induction601
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
1
$begingroup$
I think that you don't need the uniform convergence of $f_n$ and $g_n$ for $(f_ntimes g_n)(x)$ to converge to $(f times g)(x)$ pointwise. Moreover, isn't the important difference between pointwise and uniform convergence the fact that you can choose $N$ such that it depends only on epsilon and not on $x$? In other words, you haven't used uniform convergence in your argument.
$endgroup$
– stressed out
Dec 29 '18 at 20:22
$begingroup$
@stressed out: Thanks!
$endgroup$
– Omojola Micheal
Dec 29 '18 at 20:26